Michael: But they were ignorant that they were connected to the divine and they were ignorant that the black people were connected to the divine. But underneath there was a spiritual energy trying to happen. But it was coming through ego and it was coming through the prism of ignorance. Because it can't be God and something else. That would mean that God is not infinite. You see? There can't be God and. There can only be God. And then you're either in it, you're aware of it or you're ignorant of it. If you're ignorant of it—

Oprah: So you're in it but you're ignorant of it. I just got it.

The Rev. Bacon: I would like to know the spiritual application of this question for you?

Elizabeth: Yeah.

The Rev. Bacon: Why is this relevant to you?

Elizabeth: Good question.

The Rev. Bacon: Wendy?

Wendy: No, it was just on a broad level I was just thinking what—to me, I could think of money, power, power being one that I think that seems to be a real problem with our society, and then you can get down on a lower level of things, which is your drugs and that sort of thing. So I just wanted to put it out there and see if you could come up with something that would be one thing, and I like the idea that you mentioned at the beginning about I think you called it the human side and love because I think when it comes down to it, if you have love for yourself and love for other people and love and joy in your life, then that—that does cover a lot of the other areas as well and it eliminates the need for other things in your life such as the drugs and alcohol and that sort of thing.

Michael: Absolutely. See those are symptoms. What she's describing are symptoms of an individual that's cut off from the light or is ignorant of their true nature and being. And so they have coping mechanisms, defense mechanisms, compulsive behaviors, all kinds of behaviors that are symptoms. Drugs, abuse, etc. But it's from ignorance. Not being—being unconnected consciously.

Oprah: Thank you very much all the way from Australia.

Wendy: Thank you.

Oprah: Thanks, Wendy.

Michael: From Oz.

Oprah: Let's go to the phones. Debbie's on the line from Erie, Pennsylvania. Hi, Debbie.

Debbie: Hi, Oprah. I was married to my husband for 32 years. And after, oh, about three years ago, he told me he was gay. And I basically lost all my faith in everything and spiritually, how would I—how do I get that back? How do I get back my faith again in anything and everybody?

Michael: Wow.

The Rev. Bacon: I think the first question is— actually is not about regaining your faith. The first question has to do to make sure you're grieving a huge loss. That's such a significant loss. And that needs to be respected.

Elizabeth: Yes.  

The Rev. Bacon: Your loss needs to be respected, and that's going to take some time. And Jesus said, "Blessed are they who mourn for they will be comforted."

Oprah: Yes.

The Rev. Bacon: The word "comfort" means to be made stronger with. Come fort.

Oprah: Be stronger with.

The Rev. Bacon: And you will, over time, receive your power back. I promise you. The faith will come. But it is very important to mourn first.

Debbie: Yes. And that's what I'm doing now. It's been three years, like I said. But it's still—it's a big loss, and I still feel very empty and a great loss, you know.

The Rev. Bacon: And I—

Debbie: In life.

The Rev. Bacon: —hate to be a broken record here. What about your support group? Are you in connection or community with one or two or three other people who truly understand and respect your grieving process and your desire to regain your faith?

Debbie: No, not really. I—like I go to therapy but—

Oprah: One side, yeah.

The Rev. Bacon: That's tough, my friend. It's important to tell some other folks and ask them in. None of us can heal alone. None of us.

Debbie: Right.

Elizabeth: What I would like to say besides really supporting what Rev. Ed says about mourning and the preciousness and necessity of grief, what you begin to come back and regain—regain your strength, a trauma as large as this and a loss as large of this carries with it the potential with an awakening equally as large and that awakening is about yourself. It's not about anyone else. It's about, first of all, who were you in the marriage? What was going on all those years about you that you didn't know?

Debbie: Right.

Elizabeth: And then how do you choose again and reenter? And there's so much fertile ground for you to use this as your springboard spiritually into enormous self-knowledge.

Oprah: So this is what you're talking about. Out of aberration there's a spiritual aspiration.

Michael: Absolutely. And not wanting to in any way inhibit the grieving process, but I think what Elizabeth is saying here, when Jesus spoke and when—he was always talking about consciousness. And so when he's saying, "Blessed are those that mourn," he's saying blessed are those who have had terrible losses. And those terrible losses are paradigm shifters. They allow us to change our thinking. To open us up to new worlds. So she's going to be invited to live in a new world based on this crisis. So you have to go through the grieving process. You have to acknowledge what is lost. You have to acknowledge who you were in the marriage.

Oprah: That's so good.

Michael: The decisions that you made or did not make. And at the same time, the universe is inviting you to become way bigger than you ever thought you could possibly be.

The Rev. Bacon: Amen.

Michael: Through this mourning process.

Oprah: Mm-hmm.

Michael: Blessed are those whose identity is shaken so that they can begin to discover that part of them that can never be shaken.

The Rev. Bacon: I—

Oprah: Wow, that made my eyes water right there. I got a little tingle.

The Rev. Bacon: Let's have a moment there then.

Oprah: That's a moment. That's pretty amazing. Pretty amazing. Did you feel that too, Debbie?

Debbie: Yes, I did. Definitely.


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