To Butterflyforjesus. It would unfair not to point out to you, as many posts previously in this forum have done, that the scriptures you quote are erroneous if read out of context. I question and reject what you want them to mean. Leviticus has been established as codes of living, which many of the “abominations” listed would be ridiculous to enforce with the death penalty in today’s society. Your quotes of the New Testament were by Paul, who came into the picture long after Christ’s death. Those were his words, not of God. Jesus never says anything about homosexuality.

There are many different versions of the Word today, and it is a known fact that they have been modified, and some have insidiously referenced homosexual acts in though the original texts did not. Also, the books in the Bible are not exhaustive works about God. They are merely a selection out of multitudes. The Catholic faith regards writings of Popes and saints as equally important devotion as the Bible. The Bible depends on interpretation, and many have done so. Much evil has been justified in its validation from the Bible: slavery, anti-semitism etc.

To use one of your quotes, which suggests “homosexuals” will not be a part of God’s promise of eternity. You are referring to those born as homosexuals? Or those who engage in homosexual acts? Applying your “literal” interpretation, it’s everyone. See the absurdity?

I am writing this, as many previous posts did, to inform that God does not condemn homosexuality. The Bible, inspired by God, and by God’s grace, wrote against homosexual acts. By this, they show that, at that time, sadly even now, they do not understand homosexuality as we know it today. Homosexuality orientation is part of God’s design. LGBTs are born, not defiantly chosen as a lifestyle to spite. Quoting scriptures do not make your point and I hope you will be enlightened by the Truth. Oakdragon’s previous postings cover considerable details.

Why, does one ask, do we so laboriously decipher every word of God to its original source? It is because the Bible has been quoted literally to justify denying LGBTs our rightful place in this world, and the one to come.

Even if you are right, that the Bible does condemn homosexuals. I think it is fair to say that the Bible is written by heterosexuals, of a time that is past. Unlike now, where LGBT cause is openly discussed, researched, and informed. By the grace of God, bigotry, ignorance, and apathy reveal themselves when men try to condemn what they see, without regard to the personhood behind the condemnation. Affixing God as the stamp on their prejudice, they only judge themselves.

I dare you, those who claim to know God, to join our cause for justice.

Many seem to be forgetting that the bible's not the only holy book around. If your interpretation of the bible forbids you to have homosexual relations, that's shouldn't pose a problem - nobody's forcing anyone to do anything. When I said I have strong faith in God, I meant faith in a Hindu-context, which by no means redlines homosexuality. Truth is what you believe it is. Your faith in the bible leads you to your convictions; your truth. My faith is no smaller and no more inferior to yours has a very different message, and in my truth, the only difference between a heterosexual relationship and the loving one I have with my partner is that we don't have tampons in the bathroom. So why should it be wrong?

You're absolutely right. we christians can be so totalitarian at times. Thinking the Bible has the only solution, but in fact, would we be living in India or Indonesia, we would believe lots of other things, defending it with the same fervour.

IT'S NOT FARE TO TALK ABOUT GAY AROUND THE WORLD AND NOT TO TALK ABOUT GAY IN IRAN.
IT'S NOT FARE TO TALK ABOUT GAY MALE IN IRAN AND NOT TO TALK ABOUT IRANIAN LESBIAN.

IT'S NOT FARE OPERA


WE ARE AN IRANIAN LESBIAN COUPLE WHO HAVE WROTE ARE STORY LIFE TO MANY TIMES FOR YOU.
WE WANTED TO TALK ABOUT OUR LIFE WHICH HAS BEEN TAKEN AWAY FROM US BY IRANIAN REGIM JUST BECAUSE WE ARE LESBIANS.

WE ARE REFUGEES RIGHTS NOW AND OUR LIFE IS IN DANGER.

OPERA TALK ABOUT GAY BUT IGNORE THE LESBIANS IN IRAN.

IT'S NOT FARE TO TALK ABOUT GAY AROUND THE WORLD AND NOT TO TALK ABOUT GAY IN IRAN.
IT'S NOT FARE TO TALK ABOUT GAY MALE IN IRAN AND NOT TO TALK ABOUT IRANIAN LESBIAN.

IT'S NOT FARE OPERA


WE ARE AN IRANIAN LESBIAN COUPLE WHO HAVE WROTE ARE STORY LIFE TO MANY TIMES FOR YOU.but have been ignored.

WE WANTED TO TALK ABOUT OUR LIFE WHICH HAS BEEN TAKEN AWAY FROM US BY IRANIAN REGIM JUST BECAUSE WE ARE LESBIANS.

WE ARE REFUGEES RIGHT NOW AND OUR LIFE IS IN DANGER.

OPERA TALKs ABOUT GAY BUT IGNORE THE LESBIANS IN IRAN.

we are two activis and we have published the first iranian lesbian e-magazine
Our goal is to help iranian lesbian who no one has heard from them untill now.


Being a lesbian is not a crime. We didn't choice to be lesbian it's our nature, but we have right to live. Don't we? Why our punishment of being lesbian should be execution, stoning and hanging. Our only crime is to be in love, there have been other Iranian lesbian who had this situation but no one heard their voice. They have been arrested, raped, lashed but no one did help them. Some of them got refugee statue in some country and some of them were vanished and no one looked for them. Beside all our problems of being a lesbian in Iran and how we told our parents about our self and what the make us to go through (psychologist ,hormone doctors ,...all kind of doctors that our parents send us to change our sexual orientation) the government also wants to kill us because of being lesbian

It's Oprah.

I appreciate your courage in expressing what is going on in Iran.

It is nature, and of course you have every right to live.

I don’t know if Oprah has time to read all these posts, plus this thread refers to an older show. But you can speak to Oprah’s staff about ideas for a show.

Go to the home page. In the upper left corner a blue tab says: Inside Oprah. . . . Click the arrow and go all the way down to “E-mail Us.”

You may want to explore the box on the home page that says, “We want to hear from you.”

Good luck with your situation. I admire your activism, and your publishing an e-zine. You are blessed to have love and each other.

So I think we should give more support to GLBT. I know a place for them to release themselves and come out totally. One of my friends told me he has used the service of BiLoves c o m twice now and both times it has been very successful. Have a two year relationship that is still going strong and have met a new like minded friend which was the object of the search this time, he has found exactly what he was looking for both times and the site has afforded him the opportunity to live his life the way he needs to. So he looks forward to the next time he need the services.

Yes, it's clear that homosexual behavior is viewed as a sin in the Bible. So is eating shrimps and menstruation. Why do some of our fellow-Christian only read part of the Bible and ignore the rest? Is it because shrimp eaters are a majority, gays a minority, that is: easier to condemn?

Hi People who think of and call themselves Christians and then judge others on sexual preferences and other types of sin need to do som real soulsearching since they see themselves as God and quote out of context from a very complex history of man. I have three sons one of whom is gay, though not overtly so. I am also a Christian and I do not judge him and cast him out for how can one win the loved one back with condemnation. He is "just a stranger on the bus" to this son for a number of reasons, one of which was a zealous Christian friend telling him that his father went straight to Hell since he did not confess to being a child of God while on earth. At that time I was unaware of his sexual preferences and reassured him that only God could make this judgement of his father and not mere man or child. He is an amzing person loved by all who know him with so many gifts to give the world in terms of compassion that I accept that when the time is right God will bring him into the fold of believers. It is not for me to change him since I do not have the right to do that nor the strength in my own right. I give him what God asks of me which is guidance and love and I seek knowledge of Him who made the three Covenants with man. First there was the Abrahmic Covenant, then there was the Law Covenant when Moses was given ALL the laws and there are some 610 of them and finally there was the New Covenant in which Jesus Christ died for our sins and this supercedes the other two. No man may come to God unless he comes through Him who was given as a living sacrifice on the Cross. He is the Way and the Truth and the Life. The Laws were given so that man might know what constituted sin so that he could avoid it but man is by nature sinful. If my son who is gay is to come to know Jesus it is up to the Christians of the world to practise love and not condemnation for that will only drive him deeper into sin. If we are to accept that God is our Father we also have to accept that God does not make mistakes and since there have been gay men and women throughout history I think it is evident that God has a reason for creating them the way they are. My son did not CHOOSE to be gay, he was born gay. I may have theories as to why but only God really knows why. Of course it is unnatural to those of us born heterosexual but no one chooses to be part of a minority which has been looked upon and condemned through the ages. That's like saying you choose to have a brain damaged child or an autistic child. Many gay people have given wonderful things to the world which had absolutely nothing to do with their sexual preferences and everything to do with God's purpose for their lives. Yes, there may be a small number who are likely to become predators but why condemn all of them because of a minority. Heterosexual males are just as likely to be into sexual deviance and are and they take it out on the defenseless women and children in their lives and guess what there are far more heterosexual rapists and murderers in prison than there are gay ones. The Bible was written by men for the future of the world and naturally they would condemn gay men as they would not reproduce and this defeats the purpose of God's creation. Sometimes I think He made a mistake in making men first and that's why he made women so that it could all be blamed on us but that's another discussion. Serenity

correction - off should read offer in the post above

I cried this morning when I saw on YouTube a copy of a segment that Ellen Degeneres aired today on her show.

She told of a 15-year-boy named Larry who was murdered by another 8th grade boy for giving him a valentine.

I can't post the url, but it is easily searched for.

I just saw this episode in London today. I am a christian woman and I believe what the bible says. I am unable to understand how people who are gay...are gay. That may seem simple, but that is how I am. I know it is not a choice but believing in God according to the bible I do not think he made us to be that way. But people are gay and that it something we have to accept. And as people we are all linked somehow. ALL people deserve respect, love and understanding just like everyone else. We all deserve the right to make choices, after all God gaves us freedom of choice and man can not take that away. I believe in the end, when our lives are over what ever we do not understand will be revealed. And in the end we are all God's children. He loves us all, no matter what. We all quote God etc, but do we see ourselves showing our horror to people who live in defacto relationships as much as we do people who are gay. Do beat up the man who cheats the tax man, do we turn away from people who tell lies...we are told to love our neighbour unconditionally. This means everyone. We can disagree with our neighbour but we can still be friends. This was a great episode on what people have to go through across the world, but it would be great to somehow address the issues that religion faces and how we can deal with it, without compromising beliefs and taking away human rights of others.