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Click to view satori13's profile Level 1 satori13 60 posts since
Feb 14, 2008
Reply 90. Re: Dear student99, Does one have to study religion in order to be a Christian? Apr 10, 2008 6:27 PM
in response to: zulubear
Greetings to you as well. How is your day feeling or more importantly how are you feeling in this present moment?
Click to view joannarg's profile Level 2 joannarg 166 posts since
Mar 9, 2008
Reply 91. Re: Dear student99, Does one have to study religion in order to be a Christian? Apr 10, 2008 6:33 PM
in response to: zulubear
The wine and cheese thing totally resonates with me. Several years ago I was asked by a Christian group to help them "minister" to the women and children in the projects. What they wanted to do was rent a house in that neighborhood and start Bible study meetings. The irony of the whole endeavor was that there were churches on ever corner of that neighborhood, I couldn't see the point of trying to build another. I had spent enough time with these women and children to know that what they really needed was a free place to wash their clothes. I took it upon myself to get washing machines and dryers and I suggested that we could simply be there to help fold clothes, enter into relationship and just listen etc. Needless to say I was asked to leave. The leaders of the group wanted scalps on their belt, new converts through Bible study......it was all an ego game.

Initially I was offended. But I now understand that they hadn't been touched by the man in blue, so how could they "know." They were just doing what they thought was best.

Click to view cbasich's profile Level 3 cbasich 328 posts since
Mar 2, 2008
Reply 92. Re: Dear student99, Does one have to study religion in order to be a Christian? Apr 10, 2008 6:40 PM
in response to: zulubear
Sounds like good people to me! :-)

You are going to LOVE The Gospels because as you read them you find out that Jesus travelled all over with His disciples, spending time with families and small groups! He AVOIDED the rich and even spent plenty of time with those that many deemed unlovable like those with leprosy. He brought His Good News to the people and did miracles and healed the sick and the blind. He CRIED with many, showing how much He truly loved His people.
Click to view zulubear's profile Level 5 zulubear 1,216 posts since
Jan 31, 2008
Reply 93. Re: Dear student99, Does one have to study religion in order to be a Christian? Apr 10, 2008 6:40 PM
in response to: satori13
WA! I gotta tell ya my day yesterday began in a'bumpin' bad way.

Iam watching myself on these boards Iam seeking to know if Awareness knows about egopainbody.

Wondering when the painbody was going to strike again, only this time while Iam prepaired.

I know Iam being guided through something.

So I woke up this morning confused about my light.

I knew these boards would bring me 'In.

And all could think of was asking student99 a question.

Iam so amazed at what has transpired!!!!!!

huge huge mystical touchings in my heart, I have been full of warm all day.

You know the words I ahve used on 'have you ever had a mystical touch'?

Well Iam being ever so gently guided to seeing in a New light with all these amazing folks.

Get this they even fed me chicken soup for lunch.

Then I got invited for wine and bread!!!

And now Iam being visited by satori!!!!

To tell you the Truth Iam having an awakening.

Oh! the way best part?

Iam Being guided by my inner child!!

Take alook my innocence is being treated like I have just arrived on a New Earth.'

I had no idea the people here were so darn down to earth friendly.

How are you?

zulubear
Click to view zulubear's profile Level 5 zulubear 1,216 posts since
Jan 31, 2008
Reply 94. Re: Dear student99, Does one have to study religion in order to be a Christian? Apr 10, 2008 6:55 PM
in response to: cbasich
Ah the underdog, I gotta tell ya they are the teachers in this world for sure!

They never ever argue Truth and they are the quickest to point you in the right direction if you stray from the path.

zulubear
Click to view cbasich's profile Level 3 cbasich 328 posts since
Mar 2, 2008
Reply 95. Re: Dear student99, Does one have to study religion in order to be a Christian? Apr 10, 2008 7:04 PM
in response to: zulubear
Hi zulubear!

So true! My daughter-in-law just got back from El Salvador. She and her delegation of physical therapists stayed with the people and ate in their homes. The people had VERY LITTLE, but they graciously shared everything they had. My daughter-in-law was DEEPLY and PROFOUNDLY changed because of her experience! She's headed back there in the future!
Click to view zulubear's profile Level 5 zulubear 1,216 posts since
Jan 31, 2008
Reply 96. Re: Dear student99, Does one have to study religion in order to be a Christian? Apr 10, 2008 7:12 PM
in response to: cbasich

Dear cbasich American idol is playing in tha background and they are singing of all things a song about Jesus.

My goosebumps are crying tears of Love.

Is is okay to tell you that I feel you have a been a True good Christian today.

So cool it is like they are singing it right into my cells.

"Nothing compares to the promise I had in you" is the name of the song or something like that.

zulubear

Click to view cbasich's profile Level 3 cbasich 328 posts since
Mar 2, 2008
Reply 97. Re: Dear student99, Does one have to study religion in order to be a Christian? Apr 10, 2008 7:21 PM
in response to: zulubear
Hi zulubear!

My heart is very full of love as I read your post, and my eyes are full of tears of joy! I am so thankful that I was able to be of help to you today. I believe that The Holy Spirit works in us and leads us. Today as I was preparing for my walk I decided to check in on these messageboards. I am thankful that I did, because I believe that our day was meant to happen.

I thank you for sharing your need and for asking your questions.

Jesus is smiling! Can you see Him in your heart? He is happy to have you home!
Click to view zulubear's profile Level 5 zulubear 1,216 posts since
Jan 31, 2008
Reply 98. Re: Dear student99, Does one have to study religion in order to be a Christian? Apr 10, 2008 7:50 PM
in response to: cbasich
Yeah so hear is what Iam wondering and believe me you I would never in 2008 years have thought I would ever see this thought cross my lips.

Much less in public.

Do you think from any of what you have read that it could be that I have been living with Jesus inside me all along?

Is it possible that had the Sunday school teacher been like the ones I met today.

And I stayed with Sunday school studying the bible through one churches perception.

That I would still have the apparent innocence of heart with this subject?

zulubear
Click to view cbasich's profile Level 3 cbasich 328 posts since
Mar 2, 2008
Reply 99. Re: Dear student99, Does one have to study religion in order to be a Christian? Apr 10, 2008 8:01 PM
in response to: zulubear
Hi zulubear!

Yes! Jesus has been right there! I'm sure that The Holy Spirit was there guiding you toward this very moment in time!

Quite possibly you will have a greater appreciation for your journey BECAUSE OF that Sunday School teacher! Often it is the CHALLENGE that refines us and leads us to seaching for Jesus! If things are perfect in our lives we tend to feel that we don't NEED any help.

Eckhart touched on this when he talked about Christopher Reeve and also about his own experiences in his life.

Each day is a new opportunity for us! You are your true new self at this very moment! Happy Birthday!
Click to view zulubear's profile Level 5 zulubear 1,216 posts since
Jan 31, 2008
Reply 100. Re: Dear student99, Does one have to study religion in order to be a Christian? Apr 10, 2008 8:05 PM
in response to: cbasich
Ok so is this where Iam supposed to say you are a God send?

Feels like after 44years Iam getting the hang of this.

Gee for first time 'i' won't be fround upon for really meaning it!

zulubear
Click to view cbasich's profile Level 3 cbasich 328 posts since
Mar 2, 2008
Reply 101. Re: Dear student99, Does one have to study religion in order to be a Christian? Apr 10, 2008 8:23 PM
in response to: zulubear
Hi zulubear!

This would be a GREAT time to just talk to Jesus and tell Him everything that you want to tell Him! Remember: Everything that you experienced today was The Holy Spirit guiding you along the way! (When Jesus had to return to His Father in Heaven He sent The Holy Spirit to be with all of us FOREVER. Wasn't that WONDERFUL?!!)

Of course you are getting the hang of this!:-) You are well on your way!

Remember, we are ALL learning! We are just learning different things!

It will be helpful to also ask for increased understanding as you read your Bible. I ask for that all the time!

God Bless You, zulubear!
Click to view student99's profile Level 5 student99 2,383 posts since
Feb 1, 2008
Reply 102. Re: Dear student99, Does one have to study religion in order to be a Christian? Apr 10, 2008 8:33 PM

Hi zulubear,

You asked whether you have to study religion in order to be a Christian.

No, you don't have to study religion to call yourself a Christian, zulubear. You have full permission to call yourself a Christian, or any other label that you choose. To me, it means choosing to be obedient to Jesus' teaching, but the label means different things to different people. And depending on who you ask, you will get different lists of what other people will require you to do, before that person will give you their "permission" to use that label.

Some people feel like they have exclusive ownership of that particular label. That is why many people accuse others of not being "real" Christians. What we really mean when we accuse someone of not being a "real" Christian" is that someone else's definition of the label is different than mine, (and being certain that "my" definition is right).

So, the history of Christianity is awash in blood that has been spilled over who has the "right" definition of being a Christian. "My definition of the label Christian is right, so that is why I need to hurt you, to prove that I am right. My bible has books in it that your bible doesn't."

"Furthermore, you are not complying with the parts in my bible that aren't in your bible. So, obviously, by divine right, by divine permission that the bible (which I think God Himself wrote) gives me, I will kill you, for not agreeing with me." What happened to the blue light? It has been covered up by a "me" that the mind inserted into a label.

The primordial act of violence

And that is the problem with labels. Replacing a human being with a label is the primordial act of violence. They are no longer human beings, they are "unbelievers." So we no longer see the human being, we only see the label that we have superimposed over that human being. The 9/11 terrorists did not think that they were killing people, they were just killing "unbelievers."

So, the mind in us loves to invent a label, and then insert a "me" into that label. And as soon as we do that the blue light in us, that is the essence of who we are, is cut off by our own mind replacing our real identity with a mind-made identity. We declare to ourselves, and to the world, that, rather than being the blue light that in our essence we are, we are our own creator.

Your Sunday School teacher was partially right.

The essence of who we are, the blue light that we are, is not bad. But, there is a serious dysfunction in us, in humanity. So, the dysfunction is not who we are, but is in us. We are the awareness within which this dysfunction exists. As Jesus said, we are the light of the world. We are that blue light, within which all of the temporary forms of this world can be seen and exist.

What is the dysfunction? The mind in us inserts a "me" into form. In biblical terms this is called idolatry. We mistakenly think that who we are is in this body, or in this possession, or in this opinion, or yes, in this label.


And this is dysfunctional, because it causes us to suffer. As soon as the temporary form that we have identified with starts to crumble, we feel like "we" are crumbling. And the mind goes into fear, into deep emotional pain, into compulsive mode, trying to make the impermanent permanent, to keep that false "me" from dying with the temporary form.

How did the earliest followers of Jesus practice their faith?

So, using the right "label" is not what transforms our lives. The earliest followers of Jesus didn't call themselves "Christians," they called themselves followers of "the way."


Scholars think that their version of the New Testament "bible," for the first 35 to 40 years after Jesus' death was probably a collection of the sayings of Jesus rather than a biography of Jesus. So those first Gospels were not about Jesus, but about what Jesus taught. These earliest followers read his instructions of how to live and followed them.

Scholars believe that all the books in the New Testament were written after Paul replaced Jesus as the real emperor in the Roman religion of the day. That Roman religion taught that the Emperor was divine. That is where many of the titles for Jesus came from. The Son of God, the Prince of Peace, born of a virgin impregnated by a god, were titles and genealogies claimed by the Roman Emperors.


I think this is still OK, and we can still use the New Testament as a pointer to God, because the blue light is the real emperor of the world. But many Christians today don't realize that part of what they are practicing in Christianity came from that old Roman religion, rather than anything that Jesus taught.


The crucial thing in using the bible as a pointer to God, is not to treat the bible as if it is pointing at itself. The bible is not God. No form is divine, as form. So, the words in the bible point to the living word of God, which is beyond all name and form.


The living word of God, would fill more books than the whole earth could ever hold, and would still not be contained in those books, for all books are just limited temporary forms. So I strongly recommend against worshiping the Bible as if is were God, as if it were Divine.


The bible points to the divine, and nothing more. Some view the bible as an infallible divine product, which I consider to be idolatry, and produces a lot of the "bad" religious behavior - the very thing that Jesus taught us not to do. I view the bible as a fallible human product, written after an experience of the divine.


So, what can we do about this dysfunction in us?


As I mentioned before, using the right "label" or creating an imperfect opinion about Jesus in the mind that is in us, is not what will bring about the death of the "me" in form.


The basic message that Jesus taught was to repent (turn away) from this sin, this dysfunction. How? By believing Jesus' teaching and dying to the self that the mind invented and placed into form, into flesh.


And the external practice of being baptized is a symbolic representation of that internal death of the false self. When someone slaps down our self invented me, instead of going into an ego repair job, and slapping back, Jesus taught us to, turn the other cheek.


This turning the other cheek was not a rule for external behavior, but an internal death of the false "me." Let the false self in us be diminished. Why, because that false self is what blocks the blue light that is the essence of who we are from shining out. And this death of the false "me" is the same principle that Eckhart is teaching in his books.


Love our neighbor as ourself


So, once we have died to the false me in our religious opinion (the most important commandment), then we can also obey Jesus' second most important commandment, and love our neighbor as ourself. When the false me is still inhabiting our opinion, we will not be able to love our neighbor with a different religious opinion. Why not, because rather than loving our neighbor we will feel the compulsion to defend our opinion by demanding that our neighbor agree with us.


Once we fully surrender into this moment, and allow the false me to die, then meeting a neighbor with a different religious opinion won't cause us to feel like "we" are being attacked, so we can love our neighbor. So, we can only truly love our neighbor as ourselves, when we can see that the essence of our neighbor is ourselves. We are the blue light, and so is our neighbor. God is not loving, God is love itself. God is the Blue Light. And even a five year old child with no religious education can recognize God, when she sees Him.


I encourage you wholeheartedly to follow Jesus, and to use the label Christian for yourself, if you want to. But infinitely more important than giving yourself the label of being a Christian, is understanding and obeying the core of what Jesus taught.


Repent from inserting a "me" into form, believe and obey Jesus, when he says that we must surrender and die to that false ‘me" and thereby undergo the symbolic baptism, that represents the death of the false me, and the resurrection of our awareness of who we really are.


This is the resurrection of awareness of the Christ consciousness, the blue light that, in our essence we are. And when we deeply, deeply surrender, we live in the peace that passes understanding, then the blue light runs our lives, and we can say, as Paul said, "It is no longer I who live, but Christ who lives through me."

Resources

If I were to point you to one single book to read to have a better understanding of Christianity it would be "The Heart of Christianity," by Marcus Borg. The second book would be "the last week, (or the first Christmas) which are both co-authored by Marcus Borg and John Dominique Crossan. The last week is an excellent study of the Gospel of Mark, which was the earliest biographical Gospel written. I would not recommend reading the gospel of John first, since it was written long after Jesus' death, and is way out of sync with the other three gospels.



Bless you zulubear, as you walk into the blue light that you are. Student99 :-)



ANE500

Click to view angelwitha's profile Level 4 angelwitha 806 posts since
Feb 15, 2008
Reply 103. Re: Dear student99, Does one have to study religion in order to be a Christian? Apr 10, 2008 8:39 PM
in response to: student99
student99...I have been hanging out in this thred all day...and I love it! Everyone is so polite and intelligent.....I feel like I am in MENSA!!!!!!!!

You would be proud!

Oh yea...you're going to have to quit your day job!

I'm putting a resume together for you...to send to Harpobear.......so far....your legacy here IS VERY IMPRESSIVE INDEED!!!!!!!

-Angela
Click to view student99's profile Level 5 student99 2,383 posts since
Feb 1, 2008
Reply 104. Re: Dear student99, Does one have to study religion in order to be a Christian? Apr 10, 2008 8:44 PM
in response to: angelwitha
Hi Angela,

Thank you for the nice compliments Angela, and I want to be sure to point out that it is infinitely more important to bless than to impress. The blue light is what really matters.

Peace to you, Student99 :-)


ANE500
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